27 Nov
2019
27 Nov
'19
10:01 p.m.
Adding dev list. We haven't talked through much of this in any detail in
the orchestrator calls yet aside from a vague discussion about what
should/shouldn't be in scope.
On Thu, 28 Nov 2019, Paul Cuzner wrote:
Okay, but mgr/ssh is still going to be wired up to deploy these. And to do
so on a per-cluster, containerized basis... which means all of the infra
in ceph-daemon will still be useful. It seems easiest to just add it
there.
Your points above seem to point toward simplifying the containers we
deploy to just two containers, one that's one-per-cluster for
prom+alertmanager+grafana, and one that's per-host for the node-exporter.
But I think making it fit in nicely with the other ceph containers (e.g.,
/var/lib/ceph/$fsid/$thing) makes sense. Esp since we can just deploy
these during bootstrap by default (unless some --external-prometheus is
passed) and this all happens without the admin having to think about it.
Not yet! :)
sage
On Thu, Nov 28, 2019 at 2:37 AM Sage Weil
<sweil(a)redhat.com> wrote:
1- Because it's a containerized service. Things are in etc inside the
container, not outside. Sprinkling these configs in /etc mixes
containerized service configs with the *host*'s configs, which seems very
untidy to me.
2. Putting it all in /var/lib/ceph/whatever means it's find and
clean up.
On Wed, 27 Nov 2019, Paul Cuzner wrote:
I struggle with this one. Channelling my inner sysadmin: "I expect config
settings to be in /etc and data to be in /var/lib - that's what FHS says
and that's how other systems look that I have to manage, so why does Ceph
have to do things differently?" Hi,
I've got a working gist for the add/remove of the monitoring solution.
https://gist.github.com/pcuzner/ac542ce3fa9a4699bb9310b1fd5095d0
I'm out for the next couple of days, but will get a PR raised next week
to
get this started properly.
For some reason it won't let me comment on that gist.
- I don't think we should install anything on the host outside of the unit
file and /var/lib/ceph/$fsid/$thing. I suggest $thing be 'prometheus',
'alertmanager', 'node-exporter', 'grafana'. We could combine all
but
node-exporter into a single 'monitoring' thing but i'm worried this
obscures things too much when, for example, the user might have an
external prometheus but still need alertmanager, and so on.
So all the configs should live in
/var/lib/ceph/$fsid/$thing/prometheus.yml and so on, and then bound to the
right /etc/whatever location by the container config.
I'm also not sure of the value of fsid in the dir
names. I can see the
value if a host has to support multiple ceph clusters - but outside dev is
that something that the community or our customers actually want?
Most deployments won't need it, but it will avoid a whole range of
problems when they do. Especially when it becomes trivial to bootstrap
clusters, you also make it trivial to make multiple clusters overlap on
the same host.
And, like above, it keeps things tidy.
The gist downloads the separate containers we need in
parallel - which I
think is a good thing! reduces time
Sure... that's something we could do regardless of whether it's a separate
script of part of ceph-daemon. Probably what we actually want is for the
ssh 'host add' commadn to kick off some prestaging of containers in the
background so that the first daemon deployment doesn't wait for a
container download at all.
IMO, having monitoring-add deploy grafana/prom and
alert manager together
by default is the way to go. TBH, when I started this, I was putting them
all in the same pod under podman for management and treat them as a single
unit - but having to support 'legacy' docker put an end to that :)
If a user wishes to use a separate prometheus, that will normally have it's
own alertmanager too. Which alertmanager a prometheus server is defined in
the prometheus.yml. With external prometheus, rules, alerts and receiver
definitions are going to be an exercise for the reader. We'll need to
document the settings, but the admin will need to apply them - in this
scenario, we could possibly generate sample files that the admin can pick
up and apply? To my mind deployment of monitoring has two pathways;
default - "monitoring add" yields prom/grafana/alertmanager containers
deployed to machine
external-prom - "monitoring add" just deploys grafana, and points it's
default data source at the external prom url. We're also making an
assumption here that the prometheus server is open and doesn't require auth
(OCP's prometheus for example has auth enabled)
I think it makes sense to focus on the out-of-the-box opinionated easy
scenario vs the DIY case, in general at least. But I have a few
questions...
- In the DIY case, does it makes sense to leave the node-exporter to the
reader too? Or might it make sense for us to help deploy the
node-exporter, but they run the external/existing prometheus instance?
- Likewise, the alertmanager is going to have a bunch of ceph-specific
alerts configured, right? Might they want their own prom but we deploy
our alerts? (Is there any dependency in the dashboard on a particular set
of alerts in prometheus?)
I'm guessing you think no in both these cases...
- Let's
teach ceph-daemon how to do this, so that you do 'ceph-daemon
deploy --fsid ... --name prometheus.foo -i input.json'. ceph-daemon
has the framework for opening firewall ports etc now... just add ports
based on the daemon type.
TBH, I'd keep the monitoring containers away from the ceph daemons. They
require different parameters, config files etc so why not keep them
separate and keep the ceph logic clean. This also allows us to change
monitoring without concerns over logic changes to normal ceph daemon
management. WDYT?
I'm sure a lot of the above has already been discussed at length with the
SuSE folks, so apologies for going over ground that you've already covered.